From FOX News:

The 54-year-old Eritrean immigrant with five children thought his only option was to save enough money to purchase a home outright, with cash earned from his job at a security company.

Then he heard about Habitat for Humanity. For some Muslim immigrants like Nurhussien, the Christian homebuilding charity that offers zero-interest loans has become a real godsend.

"The way Habitat deals fits exactly to our requirements," said Nurhussien, who bought a home earlier this year from the northern Virginia chapter of the group. "It's not free. It is no interest. It's good for me and whoever has the same belief."

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TheophileEscargot  - Seems a bit odd   |2008-10-19 09:51:00 There is such a thing as Islamic banking, which has generally weathered the credit crisis better, and it includes Islamic mortgages.

TheophileEscargot  - Hmm, that was supposed to have links   |2008-10-19 09:52:01 http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3035292.stm http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/Business/Islam...

bigbenaugust  - But wait a sec...   |2008-10-21 17:56:43 ... how does an Islamic bank make any money to support itself?

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 18:00:01 I bet they make a one-time charge for the service instead of accumulating interest. That's my guess though.

grizzly   |2008-10-21 20:36:38 From the article, it sounds like the bank buys and owns the house, and then charges "rent" to the "buyer" until the mortgage is paid off. Rent is seen as acceptable, even if the same amount paid towards an interest-charging mortgage for the same property is not.

bigbenaugust   |2008-10-22 15:12:55 I guess I picked the wrong article of the two to read before I asked. So they're probably just calling "mortgage+interest" "monthly rent" instead and getting the exact same amount out of the buyer. An interesting game of semantics.

laika  - Feds   |2008-10-19 14:15:50 the federal government should step in and demand that banks guarantee no interest loans for citizens caught in these circumstances. they obviously need a bailout.

bigbenaugust   |2008-10-20 15:59:07 More money from the government for everyone! That is clearly the answer to this and many other problems!

emperorbma   |2008-10-20 18:29:29 ... tell me about it. (/sarcasm)

WebbedFeetOfClay   |2008-10-20 19:31:34 (sigh.)

emperorbma   |2008-10-20 22:06:34 *sigh* x2

bigbenaugust   |2008-10-21 12:19:34 I will tell you about it! Think about it, now that the government has become the ultimate savior of the people, absolving them of all responsibility, they should just give us all cashola to get us out of our own problems! Ugh, I have to go throw up now.

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 12:20:57 Yeah, the sighs are 'cause Webby and I have been in a looooooooong debate about libertarianism versus socialism. :P

bigbenaugust   |2008-10-21 12:49:13 Ooooh, fun.

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 12:49:39 ... indeed.

WebbedFeetOfClay   |2008-10-21 18:27:34 no it wasn't even versus Socialism it was versus government social programs (possibly verging on socialism).

laika   |2008-10-21 20:21:12 emperorbma wrote: a looooooooong debate about libertarianism versus socialism. :P oh yeah, you must've missed the memo - The End of Libertarianism. seems as though "The financial collapse proves that its ideology makes no sense." that shtuff is so 20th century, man ;-)

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 21:03:58 What we have now is a lack of a free market.  There's the problem. I wouldn't blame ideology for a violation of it. Word to the wise: libertarian does not mean pro-big business. Unregulated market? We have a central bank! It ain't unregulated and if it was, the banks that made bad investments wouldn't be being bailed out. More importantly, though, I don't know why people assume the government will be much better when its track record is far worse.

WebbedFeetOfClay   |2008-10-21 21:48:48 where are these track records? I want to see the data you're citing. (poo. I tried.)

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 22:27:38 Quote: where are these track records? I want to see the data you're citing. (poo. I tried.) Let's see... Social Security? That's a really successful program... if bankruptcy is success. Subsidized farming? Wastes tons of goods each year. The bailout? Unnecessary and draws down the rest of our economy. The War Powers Act of 1933 (aka the IEEPA) - technically the US has been in a constant state of "national emergency" since WW2... You know I also tried here, but I guess some people interpret these facts differently.  Needless to say, I didn't say "socialism is passe" even though I don't agree with it. The threat of the Military-Industrial complex is still quite real, I think. Not some unified "evil conspiracy" but rather some unintentionally converging forces that threaten to make the system far worse than it is.

WebbedFeetOfClay  - re:   |2008-10-21 22:31:03 that's not a track record or data. It's a series of loose anecdotes none of which demonstrate the better success rate of the free market. They demonstrate that government programs can have negative results or short-sightedness, which I don't think anyone denies, they don't demonstrate one over the other (Soc.Sec. was actually tremendously successful for the time, it's a useful/near necessary service (and implementing it helped organize and streamline government/national records to the nth.) subsidized farming also kinda worked for what it needed to (while being horribly shortsighted about a few other things.) the bailout hasn't yet gone into full effect so determining this as track record is only effective if you're psychic. Especially if you claim there is little actual occurrence historically of true free market, comparing track-records is rhetoric and just about nothing else. I really think I probably shouldn't have poked at it, and for that I'm sorry. Needed that response. I'll let you have the last word on it if you like. (Also wasn't meaning to make quite the "end of libertarianism" comment. I think it's still arguable, though as I've said pretty bluntly it's an economic philosophy I seriously dislike. I just wanted to challenge the idea that one is somehow empirically/objectively established as superior)

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 23:03:39 Quote: that's not a track record or data. It's a series of loose anecdotes none of which demonstrate the better success rate of the free market. I wasn't aware you were asking for statistics, but that's a fair criticism of my reply to you. My intent in invoking the track record is to reply to the similarly baseless accusations against the libertarian philosophy in kind. I certainly hope I can be excused for not providing hard data given the circumstances, but at present I'm at a rather deep paucity thereof. There's really not much use arguing after this unless we can invoke some specific statistics, eh? Here's one that I may use in my defense, I think... good ol' Europe, the model of socialism!

WebbedFeetOfClay   |2008-10-21 18:28:39 so many quips I want to make but I fear another un-followable thread.

emperorbma   |2008-10-21 18:48:33 I refrained intentionally from making a reply that would initiate another spat of discussions. :)

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